“Homeschooling Mom” really hit the nail on the head when she stated, “Still, it just doesn’t seem right to say that a school’s educational or moral/religious environments are inappropriate for our children, but hey you do have this one program that might be beneficial to us so let us participate in it.  I think it should be all or nothing, not a la carte.”  She is exactly right.  It is for this reason that many public school parents and administrators don’t feel kindly toward homeschoolers treading on public school turf.  Also, a Catholic homeschooling mother who stated on her blog that many public schools would love to have her children on their teams, was being a bit snobbish about the whole situation, and that rubs people the wrong way.  Public schools aren’t fit places for your children, except where sports are concerned, and then….well, my homeschooled child can be the great evangelizer and show the public school children how a moral, religious, upright child SHOULD behave….I completely understand the homeschooling side of this, but we have to look at the other side’s (legitimate) gripe about the overall homeschooling attitude toward the public schools except….when we stand to benefit, such as in the sports arena.

What if an anti-public school mentality isn’t the main reason you homeschool?  My primary reason to homeschool is that we move so much that my current 8th grader would be in his 6th school right now, would have moved at least twice in the middle of the school year and we’re supposed to be moving again before this school year ends.  I homeschool so my children can have a consistent education, much more than a bias against public schools, in general (having been educated in public schools myself).  So the argument that I have blown off the public schools because I don’t want my children associating with those other children or because the education is inferior is not true.

I think you have a unique situation. First, for the record, neither my husband or I are anti-public school. My husband was public schooled, I went to private. Our oldest started out in public school and we had really high hopes for the the situation. When we pulled our child out we definitely felt we had been pushed beyond our limits and had our backs to the wall with nowhere to turn. We weren’t the only family fighting the school at that point and we weren’t they only family that removed their children that year. But I guess I still feel like you have chosen an alternative educational path because you believe our current school system does not meet the needs for your family. Lots of families move around often and still have their children in public schools. Heck, in some inner city schools children without consistent living situations change schools all the time based on where they are at any given moment. It’s still a choice you have made. You took control of your children’s education and all that entails. I believe that at its core, this law is really about parents and students wanting superstar athletes to benefit from school athletics so they can receive scholarships and accolades. If that is the path a child is on, then maybe they should be enrolled in the school. If a child doesn’t fully benefit from the homeschooling experience anymore, then as parents maybe we should reconsider whether we are making the right choice. But no, I don’t think just because we pay taxes means our children should be able to participate.

Homeschooling Mom, we do not have a national school system (and I completely agree with this, BTW).  Anyone who moves interstate has problems with different standards from one place to another.  We are not unique - there are millions of children who are military dependents who are effected by frequent moves.  Many who choose to use traditional schools make other sacrifices to give their children a more consistent education.  I know families who have left older teens with another family for a year so they could graduate from the HS where they attended for 2 or 3 years.  Often families stay behind while dad moves on - they catch up when the school year finishes.  Sometimes, the family stays put as dad moves from place to place.  More and more simply choose to homeschool.  Even if the move is local, no school system could possibly accommodate children, even those who get shuffled from relative to relative, who bounce from one school to another.  Most of us would not want to bounce from one DOCTOR to another, even within the same practice…why would we want our children to bounce from teacher to teacher? 

Even if this law was for “superstar athletes”, so what?  Average athletes would benefit as well.

Michelle, I’m sorry if I offended you, I wasn’t trying to. My example was just what popped into my head at the time. Of course military families move often and the families make tremendous sacrifices in doing so. I have relatives in the military that have made this work and have known many families in our homeschooling groups here in the military. You didn’t say whether or not you were in the military, I wasn’t assuming anything since you left it open. I knew when I posted that I would be in the minority, and at one point in my homeschooling adventure I felt that I deserved equal opportunities because I pay taxes. I just don’t feel that way anymore. There are lots of services my taxes pay for that I either don’t qualify for or choose not to use. I just happen to feel the same way about the public school system. And like you, I am very happy we don’t have a national school system. There is no way we would have the homeschooling freedoms we enjoy if we did.

You did not offend me at all.  I just wanted everyone to realize that there are many people who are trying to get their children an education under less than ideal circumstances - that we are not unique.  I think the vast majority of parents/caregivers want a solid education for their children, and many make significant sacrifices to do that - whether they homeschool or undergo family separation - and many more simply lament that their children fall through the cracks for one reason or another and they feel they are helpless to do anything about it - especially if you are considering single parent homes, homes where both parents must work to make ends meet, or homes where someone other than a parent becomes a caregiver.  I am very grateful that my husband’s income is enough to allow us to make our children’s education a priority.  My “entitlement mentality” regarding public education stems merely from the fact that I do support the public schools and the law says that my children are eligible to attend.  I do not feel that my children have the right to enroll part-time in a private school, for example (although I do think many parochial schools could benefit from reaching out to homeschoolers and making part-time enrollment possible).  At this point, I do not know if I would even participate in such programs (via a public or a private school) - I agree with one poster who suggested that very few HSers actually would enroll even if eligible.  However, knowing that my oldest son - who will be in high school next year - has very few options for sports or music lessons (especially instruments meant to be played in an orchestra/band vs solo), I would definitely consider part-time enrollment if that were an option, and I support other parents who argue that such an arrangement is “fair.”  Obviously, there are many public programs that my tax dollars support - some of which I qualify for and many of which I do not.  Although I do not actually, theoretically, support tax money being used for the vast majority of the programs that exist (and there are times I sincerely question if we should have a public school system at all), I am not saying that I should have access to a program for which I do NOT qualify…only that if I DO qualify (and my children are eligible for a public school education)...than I can’t see any valid argument as to why I should not have access to a fraction of that program.

I’m chiming in for just a moment with my personal reason for homeschooling, because I think Michelle has made extremely valuable points. There is an assumption, I’m learning, that homeschoolers make their educational choices for negative reasons—-that they are “anti” something. We choose to educate at home for positive reasons. For our family, staying home and learning together is the best education we can provide for our children. It’s our family’s choice—not a sweeping judgement of anything. I spent over half an hour on the phone with that reporter, hoping that he would understand that you can’t put homeschoolers in a box. Personally, we homeschool because we are passionate about education and want to take a greater role in the education of our own children. Before my children were born, I was a public school teacher. When they were born, I wanted to stay home and teach them instead of teaching someone else’s children while strangers taught mine. We homeschool our children because we actively pursue the very best opportunities we can for them. We don’t limit the way they learn to the four walls of a school building. We use the world as a classroom. In the case of sports like basketball and football, the very best opportunities for competition are in the public schools. Ironically, given the attention that Patrick is currently getting, that’s not the case for soccer. There, the best opportunities are private clubs and soccer academies. So, that’s one reason we want this bill to pass—it’s for the best opportunity. Another reason is that our children are well-integrated in our neighborhood. They play on club teams up through high school—and those teams have nothing to do with school except they are roughly grouped around local neighborhoods. But then, the kids hit high school age and the competitive ones are all funneled into the school athletics program. Suddenly, there’s no one left to play with kids who don’t go to the schools. Most importantly, our decision to homeschool was not a negative one: we didn’t choose to homeschool because we were rejecting or running away from the schools or the people in them.  As a matter of fact, I hear about five of those people in my kitchen right now.  We chose to homeschool for a positive reason: we wanted to continue to learn with our children in a family setting. So, the fact that we don’t send them to school eight hours a day doesn’t really have anything to do with the fact that we’d love for them to have the best athletic and community opportunities during what is typically extracurricular time.

I agree.  We’re homeschooling right now and it would be wonderful if there were a la carte options to put our tax dollars to use for us.  Many home schoolers choose to educate their children because we know our kids better than any administrator and want to tailor their education specifically to them.  I don’t understand the all or nothing philosophy. I would think the state would jump at the opportunity to work with parents, it seems too often they want complete control over your child or nothing at all.

This issue is a lot more complicated than many of you realize….Many (most? all?) states have a “no pass, no play” rule…So your homeschooled child passed Spanish at his homeschool…another child failed it in Mrs. Garcia’s class at the public school.  Home school, public school…different ways to measure passing.  So you then respond that we will take a test to show that the homeschooled child knows what the public school student knows.  No problem.  But, yes, it is a problem.  If your child was in the public school, they would have been in class, and would have been tested along with everyone else.  Now… homeschoolers will be costing the taxpayers extra money because the school will have to use resources to coordinate testing your child…all because you, the homeschooler, want to have your cake and eat it, too.  I’m just trying to point out that as homeschoolers, we are making a choice, and our choice should not make everything more complicated for the public schools.  We can’t have the best of both worlds.  And trying to include homeschoolers in the schools in an “a la carte” way, is a drain on resources, because nothing just happens without coordination and work on someone’s part…And public school parents have a right to be upset when homeschoolers take up teachers’ and administrators’ time with this “a la carte” business.  Even if you pay taxes, that doesn’t mean that you can add to the public school system’s workload with your added demands.  Lots of ramifications here that many of us homeschoolers don’t take into consideration while saying, “But I pay taxes!”  It all boils down to the fact that you, as much as you would like to do so, can’t have your cake and eat it, too.  Homeschooling requires sacrifices, and foregoing public school sports and other activities is one of those sacrifices we must make, in all fairness.  (And, no, it doesn’t matter WHY you and I chose to homeschool.)

Well said Anne.  Our district does allow homeschoolers to participate but I am not sure how they handle the academic standards.  The points you raise are good ones.

Michelle~

You should not have to fight for speech therapy services if you live in the district!  Speak to the head of Special Education.  If they argue, simply tell them you will be contacting a lawyer. . .ALL students who have special needs are to be serviced through the district.

I’m not a homeschooler (yet;  I may be in the future), but I wanted to chime in that I think the students from charter schools should be allowed to play on the public school teams.

yes, i think the charter school kids are in an odd boat - those are *public* schools but without necessarily the big sport resources.  they’re already part of the PS system, so i dont think it translates.

as for Hsing kids…  we’re going to homeschool and i honestly don’t know how I feel about this…

I worked for a small Catholic school for a while and one year we discussed dropping our sports program since the public school allowed all the children in the district to play on their teams. It can happen.

Yes, I do. There are practical considerations about how to implement it; every school is different and has different strengths and weaknesses as it is. But it’s a public school. Yes, it should be open to anyone who is eligible to attend that school.

So good to hear.  Good points also.  One of my son’s friends is homeschooled and they have been in a robotics club together at school.  They will be doing it independantly next year though due ot the dynamics of the club.  However his friend is taking classes next year and I actually do love how this friendship evolved. All because a school opened its doors.

I wonder if it may be more difficult in Virginia.  My impression is that there is a lot more homeschoolers in the area Elizabeth Foss lives in.  If you have a lot of kids in a school district being homeschooled would it be possible to have the public school team have to take on too much?

In my area there are charter schools funded by taxes, there are private schools with only 6 kids and there are big private schools and Catholic schools.  It seems like it could get tricky to tell all of them that they can compete at the public high school because their parents pay taxes.

Most services we pay taxes on include guidelines as to what we need to do to qualify to use them.  So the question is do you qualify for anything you want at the public school because you live there and pay taxes or do you qualify because your child is a student there?  Most organizations have rules and regulations that need to be followed. I see where this can get tricky.

Robin your post is coming off to me with a bit of an attitude that homeschooling students are the only ones who have less baggage, strong values, supportive families and maturity. It feels to me a bit arrogant.  I purposely have people in my life who educate their kids in all kinds of ways.  While we public school my kids have good friends who homeschool.  I don’t see homeschooling families as not having any issues.

And from my experience public school is not failing my kids nor do I find it offensive that homecshoolers want to use resources at public schools. I find this dialogue good and is giving points from both side of the issue.

I want to remind you that you do have access to ALL the resources of the public school when you enroll your child in the school.  You have made a choice to educate your child in a different way.  No one has denied you this.  The question is the “ala carte” system.  I understand both sides of the equation.

In response to Beth.

I’m sorry, but you are mistaken I do not have access to ANY public school opportunities as our district is an all or none deal. I choose none. I have homeschooled for 13 yrs, graduated one, preparing another for graduation and I still have years to go with my youngest.

The public school system is failing. It’s disappointing to hear public school parents argue that the system is good because their child is okay, or their school is a good school. It ignores the system as a whole which is unarguably broken. Pick any area - we are behind most other industrialized nations in math and science. Minimal Basic Skills Tests are passed in mediocre numbers yet those students graduate. Schools in wealthy districts do well, middle income districts so-so and poor neighborhoods abysmally. Our school district, in Illinois where the states owes the districts millions and millions of dollars, where teachers are being laid off for budget issues - just purchased not one but two jumbo-trons for the sports complex. Parent Boosters. Wealthy District.

Kids not 20 miles from here in East St. Louis are educated in what in my opinion is a dump. As Christians, this is shameful. Those parents, all parents, need choices. 

Worry about your kid first, okay, I do too. But as long as parents only worry about their kids and refuse to see the greater picture this system won’t change and 1/3 of our nations children will be failed by it.

Public school is government-run school. It’s not a local thing, it’s not cute, or quaint, or sentimental like it’s 1952, it’s a giant, oppressive, one size fits all beast, run by bureaucrats a thousand miles away who are more interested in catering to the unions than educating children. The system must change - open access, choices, parents making decisions.

Robin,

You have chosen not to enroll your kids in school. No one denied you access.  Those are the rules of your district.

I know of homeschoolers that fail.  However, I would not make the statement that homeschooling is failing.  It is the all or nothing way you express things that I don’t see eye to eye with you on.

I have several friends that teach in inner city schools and I very much understand the struggles they face.  They are many reasons for problems in public schools that have to do with problems in our society.  It is a very complex issue.  To say that the WHOLE system is failing in my opinion is being extremist.  My goal is not to have my child perform as well as the children in China. I don’t think that country represents anything we want to follow.  My children are learning things that are light years ahead of where I was at a child. The standards keep rising and yet you are screaming failure.  I think with being the best in the world academically we would lose balance in other areas.  Academic success is not the only goal I have for my kids.

Usually what I hear from people who express their views like you do is this:  we want vouchers.  I am not at all opposed to vouchers.  The problem I have is that all schools would need to have their doors open to all children. Including the ones from difficult home situations and those with physical and learning disabilites.  See what it is like to teach in a classroom where the primary language of half of the kids is not English.  Teach in a classroom where only a few of the kids have parents that are married and even know their fathers.  Give everyone the funds but yes they must accept everyone like the public school does. Otherwise, it will be just an elitist school.  I see people who want to create an education system that excludes the marginalized in society.  Jesus hung out and served everyone.  If I have misread you I apologize.  If the parents at the local independant orthodox Catholic school want vouchers then I want to see them serve everyone not just pick and choose the best and leave the hard cases to the public school system.

I like our Homeschool sports team, too, Monica.  Many of the reasons you posted I would second, as well.  It’s not so competitive, *another plus to me* because then my two kids who are not terribly coordinated can still play without ridicule…I love that!

I don’t think homeschoolers automatically have extra funds to pay for their kids to travel with elite sports teams.  That certainly won’t be the case for us if we homeschool.

yes, many people homeschool because they can’t afford a good catholic school.  or have large families in general, so not sure where the “more money” idea comes from

Understood. If you have the money. You have the means. I had no intention of implying that all homeschoolers are rolling in the dough.  O

*actually benefit* sorry about that