Interesting how after/during the ‘college years’ seem to factor into the loss of Faith…hmmm

I hope I don’t write a book here. What an interesting study, although much of it is not so surprising. I took particular interest in the point that many ‘changed religions more than once.’ I think many who have left the Catholic, or other, religion, do so to seek a religion that conforms to their lifestyle, rather than living a lifestyle that conforms to their faith! Isn’t that easier, and more convenient, than following rules that call one to be disciplined? Sadly, it is why new religions are forming every day.
  Also, a great point about many referring to themselves as ‘Catholic’, but not practicing their faith!  I listened to a great discussion the other day from Catholic TV/Parish Family, discussing the crisis in faith formation within our church: parents sending their children to attend ccd (or faith formation classes) really, just to receive the sacrament of Holy Communion, (because that is just what you do,), but not ever attending mass together as a family or otherwise. Mass without an education of the Catholic faith, or vice versa, an education of the Catholic faith, without experiencing and participating in mass, is a wash. Either is near pointless and ineffective, without the other. 
Here is that excellent discussion, if I can link it:
http://www.catholictv.com/shows/default.aspx?seriesID=144

  I work very hard as a parent, to instill deep roots of the Catholic faith in my children, like so many here and everywhere. Our lives are committed to it.  I, too, expect at some point in their teenage/adolescent years, they will experiment or stray from our faith for awhile.  While that breaks my heart to even think about, I do have faith that with enough foundation laid down in these crucial years of their development….with roots planted deep, they will come back around to know and live the truth in their Catholic faith, and God willing, raise families of their own doing the same.
  To end on a humorous note, I like to think I saw a glimmer of hope on my vocation here as a Catholic homeschooling/parent.  The other day, my three 1st graders had to write a sentence using the word WRAP, in some form.  One of my boys sentence was the following:
I am wrapping presents for 10 of my children.
Now if that doesn’t sound like a Catholic, I don’t know what does.  : )

Laura, I agree with everything you said but I have some additional observations which I could write a book on also.

There have always been parents who have delegated the teaching of the faith to Catholic schools or CCD.  Unfortunately not only do these sometimes not teach the truths of the faith correctly but sometimes they even actively lead people away from the faith.  If the faith is not actively taught at home and lived at home it is unlikely to take root.

Secondly, my experience with Catholics who have left for evangelical churches tells me they left more for social reasons than doctrinal.  They wanted the sense of community and welcoming that these churches provide.  Lots of activities, lots of support.  Who wouldn’t want that?  It was only later that they were taught the evangelical beliefs. 

On the other end of the spectrum are Catholics who leave for ultra-conservative schismatic churches or even eastern Orthodox churches because their parishes have lost the sense of the sacred and tradition.  From heretical or bland homilies to liturgical abuses, some had just had enough.

I do think things are improving at the parish level as we seem to be getting more orthodox and energetic priests coming up which is a trickle down from having better seminaries and better bishops, most all having been appointed by JP II or Benedict VI.  So there is hope for a turn-around.

Excellent points already!  I wholeheartedly agree that people look for the religon that fits their lifestyle, and that our faith formation is lacking.  There is just *so much* to know about the church!  I have found that, if I find myself disagreeing with the church on any issue, once I research why the church stands as such, it makes sense and I can’t help but agree.  It isn’t always easy, but I do think it is right - and that’s the important part.

I guess it goes without saying that a generation of Catholics were poorly catechized in the aftermath of Vatican 2.  How do you reach those people now, who are baby boomers and generation Xers?  How does one make being a Catholic appealling to people?  How do you teach the truth to a generation of people who were taught to doubt everything, that there are no objective truths out there at all?

I’m not sure what the answer is.  Perhaps more faith centered groups with the clergy involved?  I’m certainly not overly enthused about the laity running the show at parishes.  Maybe more catecheses during the homily than feel good stories about being “Christian”.  Maybe more of an effort for whole family religious education rather than concentrating on children (in Catholic schools) and/or viewing CCD programs as a 10 year babysitting/holding tank until confirmation?  In any event, I think priests have to take more of an active role these days in guiding their flocks.

A very large percentage of the people I personally know who have left the Catholic faith are those who have a disagreement with the moral teachings of the Church and are not willing to live by them.

I would put contraception and abortion at the top of that list.

When a person chooses a lifestyle that cannot be reconciled with Church teaching and does not intend to repent of it (meaning that they don’t think they’re doing anything harmful and do not seek reconciliation), there is little to keep them there except habit and family culture…Which quickly lose their appeal and influence.

Note that this reason is not often the one that people will offer to you. It is one that is buried under numerous complaints and criticisms…But it is often the root.

THIS is one of the topics that is most important… most tender… most causing of prayer in my life. Each of the posters to this topic have said something I’d like to respond to or expand on.

To pick just two topics: Catholic parents are called… are responsible before God to share the gift that they have been given—and whether they realize it or not—at Baptism, they were given a VIBRANT faith to practice. This topic ties in with Danielle Bean’s recent ‘Am I too Catholic?’ post. Does anyone believe that most are being ‘too Catholic?’ How is that possible? We are called to a radical way of life—and it is most unfortunate that so many have come to believe in a faith that is 60 minutes deep. Sadly even many of our priests give in to the pressure of 55 minute Sunday Masses.

My second point relates to young men and women who leave for lifestyle reasons. That may be so in a percentage of folks—but I believe a bigger reason is that young people do not feel faith-nourished, faith-valued and faith-alive as they are released to the world. Read the book GUT CHECK by Tarek Saab (Spence Publishing). So many young people who enter college enter a life of rejection of the shallow faith-lives they may have been given and living before. It reminds me of the Gospel story of the seed thrown on rocky ground.

As much as I (a member of the clergy) love and evangelize our wonderful Church—I think and pray we need believers who will rise up and say ‘enough’ of the shallow youth-formation programs… enough of weak budgets for education programs for our youth… enough of parishes that don’t bring in high powered evangelists to put on missions once/twice a year… and enough of the worries about complaints from people who don’t like hard-ball preaching and calls to Truth.

I could say, sorry—I didn’t mean to preach. But that wouldn’t be true! This is such an important topic to me. Blessings. dt

I also went through questioning my faith when I was right around 23.  How funny!  But, I was too afraid to leave what I had known my whole life.  When I was 24, we started to only rarely go to church.  And, by the time I was 28, we stopped going alltogether, as soon as our newest baby had been baptized.  Even though I was in the church I had known and loved my whole life, it felt like a different church and like I was a different person. 

At 29, I prayed and prayed to know where my family was supposed to find our church family.  My prayers were answered with an answer I had already had in my heart for a few years, and so we did officially leave our church and my husband and I (and our three kids) all joined a new church.

Here’s the thing—it wasn’t the Catholic Church we left, that was the church in which we found our true home.  And, I have been seeing it over and over in the RCIA program at our parish where whole families—just like us!—start the process because they have felt called to come home.

I just think that people somehow feel like it’s “cooler” to say they used to be Catholic but left the church.  I think you don’t find as many people who want to walk around saying, “Oh yeah, I used to be Lutheran and left.”  I don’t know why that is, because I know that there are huge numbers of people who leave other churches as well.  Then again, I rarely go around saying, “I used to be Episcopalian, but I left the church.”  But, maybe that’s because I’m too busy saying, “I’m Catholic and I love it!”

Nettacow,  Great point!  I left the faith, for the reasons you stated: “people look for the religion that fits their lifestyle, and that their faith formation is lacking.”

It wasn’t until I came back to the Faith did I understand what G.K. Chesterton pointed out when he said, “We do not really want a religion that is right where we are right. What we [really] want is a religion that is right where we are wrong.”  But as you pointed out, many people in this day and age seek out Churches that fit their lifestyle.  Which is why we must pray for God’s constant conversion in the hearts of all Christians and non-Christians alike.

I am enjoying this discussion and am looking forward to reading what others have to say about this important topic.

Angie, Thanks for sharing your story.  Praise be to God!  And what you said at the end made me chuckle : )

I worry about this a lot. My husband doesn’t attend church with us often. And I just converted a year ago. I read a statistic that my kids have about a 30% chance of being Catholic as adults since their father doesn’t attend church. (Although he always says prayers wih them:)) I’m sure the stats are even worse since Im a new convert.  Anyway, the bulk of the Catholic upbrining is up to me. To say I’m unprepared and overwhelmed is an understatement. I decided that the best thing I can do is make the Catholic faith as appealing as I can. I try to expose my kids to as much of the “fun stuff” as I can. I think that someday they will appreciate all the activities we do.

I agree with MM (#4).  In most of my experience with people who have left the Faith (for other denominations)  the people left because they didn’t feel “loved” or “excepted” or they longed for “community”—all the rest of the theological stuff came much later after their initial falling away.  People who have left the Church for basically a completely secular life, left because the Faith didn’t conform to the lifestyle they wanted to live.
I think, though, that we’re bringing up a much different generation of believers—children who can DEFEND their Faith because they’ve LIVED it in their HOMES!  We as parents have seen that it’s not enough to drop our kids off at Religious Ed classes or enroll them in Catholic Schools.  If it’s not happening in our homes, it’s not going to stick.  Actually, the statistic is that 50% of kids in Catholic Schools will leave the Faith and 50% of kids in public schools who are enrolled in CCD will also leave the Faith.  The difference?  It’s either being lived at home, or it isn’t.

Yeah Deacon Tom!!  I am a convert of 7 years.  I DH was Catholic and in our 20’s we were both agnostic.  However in my 30’s I felt the God’s nudges and my Dh was not going to convert to be an Episcaplian.  Since then (my conversion)  I have grown to love and charish our faith.  I have not allowed my teens to go to the watered down 70’s groovy band with drums and electric guitar teen mass. For many reasons first, and in my mind most important I do not want to go to different masses.  The teen mass is in the evening and my little don’t do well at that time.  Second the one time that we did go to that mass the girls were flirting with the boys, most were dressed provocatively.  I am not saying that all kids don’t get something from this mass I am sure that they do, however why do we have to water it down so much.  Are you trying to get there attention?  If that was the case I am afraid there attention was strayed.  There is so much beauty in our faith.  Why do the teen masses miss the mark so badly?

I think people are getting tired of the same rituals over and over, people are also reading the bible and finding out that some of the information that the Church is putting out is nowhere to be found in the bible.
The Church has to change and make services interactive and fun. They alos have to wake up and smell the time are reality sometimes it seems that the Holy Father is on a different time period and do not want the moderm times.

Gus do you have examples of things that the Church teaches that are not found in the Bible?  I challenge you to put forth some “non-biblical” Catholic teachings, because everything that the Church does does not contradict Sacred Scripture.  Especially since the Church compiled the Bible herself!

One of the things that I found lacking was that there was nothing available, social or religious for the age that when you were no longer considered a “youth”.  You were not married so you didn’t fit into the only young adult group there was and you were too young for the retired group.  Something that other faiths seem to do very well is have activities for ALL age groups.  I attended many activities with my protestant friends—there were unfortunately no Catholic activities they could attend with me since they did not exist.  I did not ever think of converting to their faith and my friends made sure that they all knew that I was not up for conversion.  Why can’t those social and religious activities be incorporated into our Catholic parishes??

Rose, I think one reason that many parishes can’t serve the needs of every demographic is because they are too small.  The evangelicals developed these non-denominational megachurches which naturally have more resources and more activities.  I personally would be in favor of merging smaller parishes into larger parishes.  This would also help deal with the priest shortage.  I live in a suburb with a ton of small parishes but none of them offer much more than CCD,  youth group and retiree type groups.  I remember when I was in college but lived at home and commuted to school I felt I had no way of meeting other Catholics since the young adult groups were for singles who were in the professional world and looking for a spouse.  I was just looking for Catholic friends at that age.

I think that is very true.  I grew up in a fairly large city.  There were atleast 6 large parishes just on the side of city that I lived in—that didn’t count the ones on the other three sides of the city.  I still don’t understand why they could not have had a city wide single adult group but I never saw any effort to even try.  There was even a survey sent out to all registered Catholics asking what were some of the functions we thought were lacking.  That fact was mentioned on the survey by all the ‘young adult singles’ but that was as far as it ever went.

MM, I grew up in a huge parish that had a group for every age group, but it tended to feel rather impersonal.  I now attend a much smaller church that doesn’t have as many “groups”, it just has community.  A lot of young, unmarried adults attend Mass every weekend.  Since the parish is so much smaller, they can take on responsibilities much younger.  Plus, when you close churches, people often leave the Church.  Yes, their faith should be stronger, but “lead us not into temptation”.

I’ve been thinking about this since the post & wondered if I was going to add anything ... I guess I decided that Yes, I will.  ; )  I don’t know about other parishes & their youth programs but I can tell you that we have a new youth minister at our parish (she’s been here for about a year and a half only, fresh out of college) and while she is surely “on fire” all I see of the youth programs is TONS of service (not bad to have service, don’t get me wrong here) that the kids are “required” to do depending on their age group…but I can’t help but wonder “where’s the meat”??  I mean, do we want all these kids to be great at service opps but not even KNOW their Faith??  I’ve experienced this firsthand w/our oldest son b/c even though we were homeschooling, we were pushed into the CCD program starting in 7th grade thru 10th when he was confirmed.  Because we live our Faith at home, use Catholic curriculum & such, he learned absolutely NOTHING in his CCD classes…and I taught them so I know what was being taught using their curriculum.  What I found to be even sadder is that some of the students had parents who were teaching other grade levels but these students fully admitting that their families do NOT attend Sunday Mass…EVER.  It’s a problem all the way around to be sure.

I also have the full responsibility of raising our children Catholic as my dh is Catholic in name only (went through RCIA before we got married) and doesn’t come w/us at all except for when our children are receiving a sacrament.  Since I have only one girl who is 3 and all the others are boys, I worry tremendously about the message they are receiving from dh.  However, he is VERY strict about their “Church clothes” and will help me herd everyone around on Sunday mornings.  It is important to him ... to a point but not enough to go/come with us.  So far my almost 18 yr old has NEVER complained about coming to Mass or confession and that is a huge blessing to me…but I worry about what he will do when he turns 18 and I can’t (essentially) ‘boss him around’ anymore.  (sigh…)

Rose,  Have you looked at a diocesan Young Adult program?  They are popping up all over the place!  They usually offer at least a Theology on Tap and possibly a FIAT. 

One of the reasons why there is so few Young Adult events is there isn’t enough young adults to attend them!  We have a Young Adult Committee at my parish and if we get 10 people to come to an event that we publish diocesan wide we consider it a success!  It’s an important ministry, one that I thoroughly believe in and participate, but it’s not easy and can be very discouraging.

What is encouraging is there are more and more Young Adult groups being created at the diocesan and parish level.  When I decided that I wanted to meet more like-minded individuals I turned to my parish and diocese.  There wasn’t anything there 5 years ago but, encouragingly, there are more and more events now.  You need to look and maybe even see how you can start one yourself! 

Religious education is also hard.  We have a great DRE who requires our confirmation students go to Mass every week (they need to sign in or produce a bulletin from another parish signed by the priest) and even doing that is a struggle.  We’ve lost more students by having this requirement and a requirement that you miss no more than 2 classes or you repeat the year (without a valid reason such as illness).  The parents are outraged that we have such requirements and inevitably take them to the parish down the street that is much more lax.  It can be very frustrating!  But as long as that lax parish exists ours will continue to lose parishioners.  Very sad.

Kristi Carlson,  I agree with you that the percentage of kids, of parents who do not practice the same faith, that stop going to Church when they get older older is probably even higher than 30%!  My mom was Catholic and my step-dad was Presbyterian and out of my four brothers and my sister, my sister and I are the only two who go to Church, but I have a feeling that my sister is going to follow in their footsteps.  My parents and my sister now all attend a non-Denominational Church now.

We had a very interesting discussion a few weeks ago over on MyChurch.org about "Why men hate going to Church".  It was a very good discussion.  I was the only Catholic Christian taking part in the conversation, so this is not just a Catholic problem.  The conversation started becoming somewhat negative towards the end so they rephrased the question to "Why men LOVE going to church!".

Gus, I totally disagree with you.  Anyone who says that the Church needs to “get with the times” wants to go to church for all the wrong reasons (see my post above #3).  One of the reasons I came back to the faith was because she does not cave to secular trends when it comes to the liturgy.  If you actually look at the Church’s teachings on certain issues today, you will surely see that she has been ahead of the times in most cases (just not on the side that you would like her to be).

I know a male, convert who said that one of the main reasons he became Catholic was because the Church does not water down her message like so many of the other Churches he had attended prior.  They were too “wishy-washy” he explained.

Rose One of the things that we have at our (small) parish is Generations of Faith, which is much like a youth group, but for whole families and people of all ages.  What is nice about this is that it encourages parents to actively live and teach the faith to their children.  What we are finding is that in many cases it is the children who are doing the encouraging.  We prepare a take-home kit that continues the topic in the home.  It is difficult to design a G.O.F. session that caters to each and all generations, but so far it has really helped our parish grow closer.  I’ve learned a lot from the older generation and I’m sure they’ve learned a lot from the younger.  We’ve also gotten the teens and young adults involved in planning, which is great!  So this might be an option for smaller or large parishes.  It is a lot of work, but boy is it worth it.  And prayer is so vital to the planning of such an activity.

I found this study interesting but not completely surprising. In talking with friends, many of whom have now become active in the church again, they often mention a time in their late teens-early 20s when they distanced themselves from the church. Many of these people had strong Catholic upbringings. I think this stage in life is difficult for Catholic young people as they begin to experience the “real world” and face challenges to their faith. If they are not well-prepared to deal with the conflicts between the church’s teachings and the secular world, they will most likely lean towards the secular world because its influence is so encompassing. In my city, the young adult groups have become more active in recent years and were a huge support for me. This, however, is a recent change and in the past this age group was not often ministered to very well. Hopefully more emphasis on youth/young adult groups will help this age group deal with the challenges they face as Catholics.

It is simple. We have done a lousy job educating our people about the faith for about 40 years now. We spend very little on this, and we get what we pay for. Masses and masses of people who know nothing to very little and have nothing to offer their children. The sacraments become empty ceremonies followed by big parties. The tide can be turned but it must be a united effort from all concerned

Tim and Susan,
I agree with you both that it comes down to teaching Catholics what it means to be Catholic.  I’m not sure CCD and Catholic schools do a good job (overall) of that.  I’m completely at a loss as to why my children (who attend public school) have to spend 8 years in CCD, taught by stay-at-home moms, with nary a priest or religious in sight.  The bureaucratic parish system with the DRE and all those committees just seems so futile and uninspiring.  Don’t get me wrong, I’m not knocking stay at home CCD teachers (I am one myself), but I wonder why the clergy has completely dropped the ball on religious formation of the laity?  Why is it completely up to the laity to pass on the faith?

Jennifer, maybe the clergy and religious aren’t teaching because there aren’t any.  There’s a big shortage - haven’t you heard?  Maybe part of the the solution is to encourage vocations amongst are own children.  Most Catholic parents don’t actively encourage vocations.

MM, I completely agree!  Just in our parish of a few thousand families, we have one aging priest who does ALL the daily Masses and they just recently found him some weekend help so he only has to do 3-4 Masses plus confessions and he works part time for the bishop, too.  There aren’t enough priests to go around but, sadly, I think that even DRE’s get so caught up in formalities & “red tape” that the truths of our Faith are being lost right from the get go.  Case in point:  Obama being elected by misinformed Catholics…

MM,
My brother is a priest and my father was a
professor of moral theology at a major seminary in the Northeast.  I am well aware of the priest shortage.  We have two full time priests at my parish and two in residence.  Our diocesan seminary has been graduating a record number of priests in the past five years, albeit many come from outside the US.  So how does one explain that at our parish school (which less than 5% of the parishoners’ children attend), there is no religious instruction by priests?  Are the four in residence too valuable to our parish to spend time with religious education?  With the majority of the children attending CCD, where are they?

I believe that the majority of people in today’s generation, that being defined as people in their late teens to early thirties, leave the Church because of two reasons: disagreement on beliefs on sexuality and spiritual apathy.

As a youth minister I saw both of these issues come to play with the teens with which my wife and I worked. Yet of the two, apathy is by far the bigger culprit.

We spent literally hundreds of hours exploring the Church’s teachings on sexuality and the body. For those that cared to learn, it was a time of enrichment and encouragement. I can see that in the lives of a few of the teens that I still keep in touch with. For those that didn’t care, no amount of discussion was going to get through because, sadly, that message was not being taught at home.

So why are teens so apathetic about the faith? I think the blame lies in two places: the home and the Office of the DRE (director of religious education) at their parishes.

From what I saw, the majority of parents who sent their children for confirmation were doing it merely out of tradition. The teens would learn about the faith in their classes but when they walked into their homes, that faith was not put into action. My wife and I were fairly disgusted to hear from our DRE that many of the parents of the kids in confirmation didn’t even attend Mass with their kids, if at all.  Many “Catholic” parents are simply not holding up to the vows they took when their children were baptized. It takes a special kid to remain energized about the faith when the family is so apathetic about it.

Why do I also put the blame on DRE’s? Well, because many of them are stuck in the past. They used antiquated methods. And while many have the noblest of intentions, they do not take the proper time that is needed to establish relationships with teens. While it’s true that sound, orthodox, and consistent instruction of the faith is essential, the missing component in nearly every religious education program I have encountered is the personal element. These teens need to be introduced to Jesus as a person, as the living God that desires a relationship with them. Some DRE’s try and shove the personal experience into a two-day retreat at the end of the year. That’s not enough!

From day one, DRE’s need to establish relationships with their teens and they MUST provide opportunities for teens to experience the compassion, the love, and the person that is Jesus.

Teens who have this encounter are much more likely to stay involved and in the faith. I don’t have any hard data to prove this, but I have seen this in the lives of the teens that I’ve worked with.

Javier,  You bring up some good points!  We must have a living relationship with the Lord.  Without it, the Sacraments become simply ritual (not to say that God can’t still work in the hearts of those who view them as such).  It is in the Sacraments that our relationship with Christ is nourished.

I would add that too many men forget that we are responsible for having a Christian home.  John Paul II referred to the Christian home as the Domestic Church.  It is within the family that we form our first ideas about Life, God, His Church, Love, Prayer, Christian Charity, and so many other things relating to our Christian faith.

I’ve noticed that when some men go to church with the family, but do not participate, chances are neither will the young men in the family.  If the dad sings, so does the entire family (in my observation).  We men need to realize that we are the spiritual leaders of our homes, whether we intend to be or not.

Just one more observation about men going to church just until the kids are grown up and out of the home.  I commend these men for trying to set a good example, or for trying to keep peace in the home, or whatever their reasons may be, but it is not enough for us to just go through the motions.  Kids can see right through this as they get older.  The truth is that we need to not only be praying for the men in our parishes, but we need to engage them.  And we need to be doing the same for the young men, who will be the future husbands/fathers/priests.

Ladies, I’m not leaving you out of the equation, I’m just pointing out that husbands/fathers play a big roll in the faith formation of our families (or lack there of).

Please pray for me, a husband and a father, that I may be a good model to my child(ren) and an inspiration to my wife, in faith, in grace, and in love.